Author Topic: Soon to try 5-meo-dmt  (Read 6305 times)

Offline gurudedicationananda

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Soon to try 5-meo-dmt
« on: August 29, 2017, 01:32:13 PM »
Hi,

I am gurudedicationananda and I will soon be experiencing the unspeakable awesomeness of 5-meo-dmt (hopefully).
By "hopefully" what I mean is that I truly hope to experience gnosis, transcendence, and spiritual enlightenment.
I don't know that it will happen, and I am not  keeping any expectations, but I am willing to be open-minded and embrace whatever happens.
I don't know how accurate the following description is, but I heard one person describe smaller doses of 5-meo-dmt as being akin to "Meditation X 1000"
What I would like to do is first try vaporizing just a very small amount as a meditation aid, at least several times, to really begin to get acquanited with the molecule.
Then maybe after a week or possibly longer I would like to experience a full-on dose, perhaps 15 milligrams or so.
This brings me to my question; can the HCL salt form of 5-meo-dmt be vaporized just like the freebase?
I have heard conflicting reports.
Some say that it cannot, while many others have said that the HCL salt form of 5-meo-dmt vaporized just fine, and the only difference is that it is slightly weaker than the freebase.
Anyway, please wish me good luck, this is something that I have wanted to try for the longest time and now have the opportunity to.

Offline nottwo

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Re: Soon to try 5-meo-dmt
« Reply #1 on: August 30, 2017, 03:31:58 AM »
Good luck indeed  :)

The HCl salt can very definitely be vaped!

In theory you should up the dosage by the proportion contributed by the molecular weight of the hydrogen chloride
(((218 + 36)/ 218) - 1) * 100 = 16.5%

I personally have always found this to be an underestimation and think possibly +40% is closer when comparing with freebase. But as the dosage required varies considerably between individuals, your best bet is always going to be to incrementally increase the quantity in small steps till you arrive at the desired result.

Offline gurudedicationananda

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Re: Soon to try 5-meo-dmt
« Reply #2 on: August 30, 2017, 04:39:08 AM »
Thanks for the good, positive vibes  :)

And also thank you for that mathematical breakdown of potency comparison between the two (freebase and HCL).

And also thank you for reaffirming the fact that the HCL salt can in fact be vaporized just fine.

Now I don't really see the need of converting it to freebase; I wonder why so many people waste their time, effort, and resources into converting HCL into freebase?

This also makes me wonder why n,n-dmt HCL cannot be vaporized, even though 5-meo-dmt HCL can in fact be vaporized, as well as (I think) DPT HCL.

I do not have a milligram scale, and cannot find a good one for less than $200, so purchasing one is not an option for me right now.

But I've read from multiple sources that it is essential to have a milligram scale when working with 5-meo-dmt.

Do you think that this is necessary?

I also wanted to ask you if you think that the transcendent state of enlightenment/samadhi is possible through vaporizing the right dose of 5-meo-dmt (and also by surrendering fully to the experience)?

I'm really hoping that 5-meo-dmt will become a spiritual ally and guide to me, to access deeper, more profound states of meditation and enlightenment.

Thanks for your help.

Offline Flux

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Re: Soon to try 5-meo-dmt
« Reply #3 on: August 30, 2017, 05:47:20 AM »
Hi gurudedicationananda and welcome to the 5Hive,

What you may notice with the HcL salt is that while it vapourises fine, it will leave a carbon residue very quickly and your glass pipe will need to be cleaned out before the next dose will burn successfully. Also in regards to dosing these little anti-static polypropylene plastic 'Science' scoops are perfect as they come in 3mg, 7mg, 10mg & 15mg sizes https://www.coleparmer.com/i/asps-02-disposable-antistatic-pp-micro-scoops-3-7-mg-green-100-pk/0627754

Taking small doses in preparation for and leading up to for a breakthrough experience is a good approach as ir will indeed allow you some familiarity when you enter the territory making 'the transcendent state of enlightenment/samadhi' that much more likely. Preparing with a good meditation prior to the journey is also good as this will clear your mind of any clutter allowing a smoother transition and an easier surrender.

blessings and safe travels,

Flux

Offline gurudedicationananda

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Re: Soon to try 5-meo-dmt
« Reply #4 on: September 06, 2017, 06:30:34 AM »
Thanks for the replies "not two" and "flux."

There is still something that I have been thinking about that bothers me.

If vaporized 5-meo-dmt can be a complete annihilation of the ego, one thing that bothers me is how my body physical body will react to such a sudden and drastic transformation.

What if my body gets torn apart?

That would not happen would it?

Does the "I" inhabiting my physical self get absorbed into/erased by a higher cosmic "I" ?

Does the small I just suddenly cease to exist and what is left within me for the duration of the journey is just infinite consciousness, space, and awareness?

I am very looking forward to trying this but also kind of apprehensive and hesitant.

I really hope that I have the authentic enlightenment experience, whatever that may be, from 5-meo-dmt.

Thanks for reading!

Offline gurudedicationananda

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Re: Soon to try 5-meo-dmt
« Reply #5 on: September 06, 2017, 12:32:55 PM »
If anyone could help me in this regard with advice as to how to surrender to the full cosmic experience of 5-meo-dmt then that would be great, thanks

gurudedicationananda

Offline nottwo

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Re: Soon to try 5-meo-dmt
« Reply #6 on: September 08, 2017, 03:23:16 AM »
Hi Guru D. A bit like asking for swimming lessons when a tsunami is about to hit you  ;D

The ego lives from fear. You overcome that fear and take it or you don't and you never take it. The last four times I have taken it have been ecstatically beautiful if that's any consolation  :)

Offline gurudedicationananda

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Re: Soon to try 5-meo-dmt
« Reply #7 on: September 09, 2017, 10:04:09 PM »
So what you are saying is that I cannot die from this, correct?

What if I actually die?

I read that 5-meo-dmt can be fatal at high enough doses.

I really hope to try this soon.

p.s. I really liked your swimming analogy  :)

Offline nottwo

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Re: Soon to try 5-meo-dmt
« Reply #8 on: September 10, 2017, 04:47:28 AM »
Hey Guru D, you are overthinking this way, way too much! Your mind can go round in circles a hundred thousand times and never find the "answer" that it is looking for.

Do I feel scared before taking this substance? - yes, shit scared every time. Have I been scared after taking it? - yes, a few times I've literally thought I was dying as everything that I imagined I was dissolved. Have I had a hard time coming back from the experience? - yes, a couple of times I've found it profoundly disconcerting (for a few minutes) to come back from being infinity to having a limited human body and thought process. But this substance has given me insight into What Is that decades of meditation, mindfulness, therapy and self observation tecniques didn't. It is simply astounding.

I think you've already received the advice you need to take it sensibly and not risk any adverse physical effects. I've in fact never heard of anyone taking 15 mg straight off and suffering any ill effect; 30 mg, yes. I'm pretty sure Dr Octavio Rettig has given over 10,000 doses of toad medicine now and Dr Gerardo Sandoval probably well over 2,000, to quote just two examples.

To sum up:
1. Have a balanced, sober sitter with you, if possible
2. Go in incrementally larger doses from 5 mg till you find your release dose
3. Avoid all MAOIs
4. Don't take it in conjunction with any other substance/drug/medicine/intoxicant
5. Don't take it whilst in the bath, driving or operating heavy machinery  ;D


Sending you good vibes and do just switch off that default mode network with some meditation or something  :)

Offline gurudedicationananda

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Re: Soon to try 5-meo-dmt
« Reply #9 on: September 12, 2017, 06:55:26 AM »
hi not two, thanks for your response again.

I actually have spoken with both of those doctors/5-meo-dmt specialists that you mentioned in your post through email.

I really did want to visit dr. sandoval for a toad ceremony treatment but it is quite a long way to travel just for one experience, and then leave either the same day or the following day.

Isn't this something that I could do by myself, without having to travel a long distance and pay a lot of money?

I really hope that I can come across 5-meo-dmt in the synthesized form, I have been looking for a very long time for this special compound.

And if you saw my post in the ethics section you are probably aware that I am against purchasing a living animal so that I can get 5-meo-dmt from it.

Offline gurudedicationananda

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Re: Soon to try 5-meo-dmt
« Reply #10 on: September 13, 2017, 07:56:49 AM »
Quote
What you may notice with the HcL salt is that while it vapourises fine, it will leave a carbon residue very quickly and your glass pipe will need to be cleaned out before the next dose will burn successfully.

Hi flux, I quoted you above.
From my understanding, based on my personal experience, the black soot/residue only appears when you use a bic lighter and the flame comes in direct contact with the bottom of the glass bowl.
Whenever I used a torch jet lighter and kept the flame an inch or so away from the bottom of the bowl, whatever I was ingesting vaporized just fine and left no black soot like material on/in the pipe.
But if there is no way around this black carbon residue forming on my pipe when using the HCL salt then what can I do?
I was going to purchase a pipe today that is very nice, it is an oil burner pipe (like a meth pipe) but of very high quality and with a wonderful appearance.
I really don't even know how to clean this thing out, and you're saying that I would have to do so after every use?
Thanks for your help

Offline Flux

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Re: Soon to try 5-meo-dmt
« Reply #11 on: September 25, 2017, 03:29:32 AM »
Interesting- thanks GuruD,

Yes, this could be the case as we only really use bics (cant remember why now-lol)...I will try a jet lighter again next time and see how that works.

usually I load two pipes of 7-10mg... the second one being there as a booster to the first- or as a re-entry after coming out from the first pipe if needed.

In regards to the question "What if my body gets torn apart?", I have found that initially there is a kind of adjustment or 'energetic' alignment of the body which can manifest as shaking, vibrating or tremors as you breath the universe though you and it breaths through you (remember as your hearts rate rises slightly and you have just held your breath with lungfuls of medicine, the body can take a minute or two to re-centre). After this, one can fully surrender and the body becomes like an empty vessel...like a didgeridoo or flute through which spirit flows freely which can physically express itself in a number of ways from throat chanting to mantras and the formation of hand-mudras or other symmetrical bodily poses or even a type of freestyle 'flow-state' dance. Feeling physically safe is vital to a good journey so having an experienced sitter is advisable or as you have indicated already start small and slowly and incrementally raise the dose until you obtain full-release.

It seems to me that the 'I' inhabiting your physical self does not so much become 'absorbed into/erased' by a higher cosmic 'I' ...than the ego-identified self is 'pushed aside' by the sheer force of universal consciousness. It is as though the ego is 'uncoupled' from the 'essential self' or essence of you (we could say spirit or soul) that is always connected to the divine, thus opening the channels for us to experience it wholly. The 'small self' does cease to exist in so much as it was always an illusion anyway, albeit a persistent one. This sense of 'I' as separate from its environment is a product of the Default Mode Network (a psychological term for what Huxley called 'the reducing valve') that filters and prioritises sensory information by selectively attenuating the bombardment of perceptual signals normally hitting our senses so that we can survive efficiently (hunt, eat, reproduce, etc). The effect of turning off the DMN is basically what one experiences with classic psychedelics like psilocybin, LSD, mescaline and DMT...hyperconnectivity of the sense, even synesthesia.

5-MeO however is the layer beyond this in which everything is so ultimately connected it has no other form but 'one' as all these parts form the sum totality of reality - and yes, what is left within your psyche for the duration of the journey is the free flow of infinite consciousness; mind, space, time, sound, vibration fused and re-merged into the state in which it arises from and ultimately returns to - one.

blessings,

Flux
« Last Edit: October 07, 2017, 04:54:58 AM by Flux »

Offline Flux

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Re: Soon to try 5-meo-dmt
« Reply #12 on: September 25, 2017, 06:50:41 PM »
Rak does a better job of the explaining this process here https://www.podomatic.com/podcasts/entheogenic/episodes/2017-09-25T10_24_19-07_00

Offline HumbleVoyager

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Re: Soon to try 5-meo-dmt
« Reply #13 on: September 30, 2017, 09:48:45 AM »
I would again suggest that this be moved to the Questions section.

That being said, dealing with fear as it comes into any powerful entheogenic experience is best dealt with by trusting that this is the right time. If it doesn't feel like the right time, then don't do it. Simple as that. If you are doing any substance because you want to "get" something from it, that is driven by your ego. If you are humbly approaching the experience with a willingness and openness to learn about whatever comes up, then that is the best mindset to go into anything with. This experience, like Flux said, is about the totality of consciousness. So it is a process of understanding and becoming All.

Everyone will have their own relationship to the experience, but I highly recommend adequate preparation be done before taking this substance. In the swimming analogy, you need to be a proficient swimmer before you try to swim in a tidal wave. Strengthen your swimming legs by sitting in unassisted mindful meditation for 15, 30, 45 minutes building up to an hour. In those meditations, become comfortable with the discomfort that arises. Become acquainted with the observer which simply observes all mental phenomena in peaceful awareness. Move through the difficulty by allowing it to happen and see what it is like to sit through meditations that feel like torture. Why all this work? Because 5-MeO-DMT is like sitting in a car moving at 500 miles per hour. If you are not fully aware and at the wheel, the experience can veer off very quickly and can turn into something very much like a train wreck. It can hinder your spiritual progress or even set you back.

There is nothing to fear from the molecule or the experience, but there is definitely a risk and there are real harms that can come from improper use, inadequate preparation, and incompetent sources of support following something of this magnitude.

I am not here to either encourage you or discourage you, but to simply share information so that you can be adequately educated about what you are choosing to undertake. Gerry and Octavio downplay the risks and dangers and thus have many patients who have struggled with integration. I have spoken with several of them. While they have administered the medicine to thousands of people, they have not done so responsibly. It is like LSD in the 60s. Psychedelics are not for everyone, but in the 60s and 70s the idea was that if everyone in the world got "turned on" by LSD, the world would become this magically better place. It does not work like that, not with LSD, not with psilocybin, not with 5-MeO-DMT. People have to be ready to experience these catalysts and not have any expectation that the catalyst will do the work for them. It won't. Only the work the individual does in the following months, years, etc will prove the changes that were suggested by the medicine.

So deeply question yourself. Sit with the deepest fears you have surrounding this medicine. Wait until you know FOR SURE, deep in your heart, that you are ready for this. Make sure that you have support for you after this experience, whether it is super positive or difficult, or neither. Know that there are MANY paths to enlightenment, and that the seeking of enlightenment is itself a very slippery road. Enlightenment is not some thing that is attained, it is something that unfolds within the self. And as soon as one thinks they are enlightened, they are not. As soon as one grasps for it, it is gone.

I hope this is helpful and know that this message is delivered with the greatest love, reverence, and respect for your journey and the journey of all other souls.

May you find the eternal joy, happiness, and peace you seek.

Offline gurudedicationananda

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Re: Soon to try 5-meo-dmt
« Reply #14 on: September 30, 2017, 07:20:41 PM »
Thanks Flux and Humble Voyager for your deep insight.
I have no problem sitting with my legs crossed for hours at a time, I am a practicing yogi with Indian parents who have dones this there whole lives.
But as far as the actual ingestion of the molecule goes, I fear that it may be too powerful, or a sensory overload if you will, and might hurl me into an exprience of great magnitude which I am not yet ready to handle.
But with smoked salvia divinorum in the long past I have melted and spun away rapidly until there was no "me" left and just an infninte continuum of absolute consciousness existing everwhere eternally.
If 5-meo-dmt is anything like that then I am more than ready for it.
I've read a few people mention that 5-meo-dmt HCL vaporizes poorly, while others say that it vaporizes just fine.
This is the substance that I will be working with.
I think that I will practice meditation for one good hour straight before I light the pipe and lay down on my floor.
I will be with the help of a sitter just because I heard that the assistance of a sitter is crucial in both being safe and integrating the session afterwards.
Thanks again for your help and I will keep you guys posted once I actually imbibe in this.